Dr. Sam Waldron and Hyper-Preterism (Part 2)—by Travis Drum
What time is it anyway?
In the previous installment I sought to prove that everything in Matthew 24:4-28 was fulfilled in the events of A.D. 70. What about the rest of the Olivet Discourse that Dr. Waldron posits as future? He writes, “Finally, it appears to me that there is a direct refutation of the preterist view in Luke 21. In Luke 21:24-27 there is a description of the destruction of Jerusalem and the events which follow it, including the exile of the Jews into all the nations and the time of the gentiles. Only after these events does Christ return. This cannot be a coming of Christ in A.D. 70 at the destruction of Jerusalem.” Dr. Waldron continues on page 355, “These words make very clear that ‘the tribulation of those days’ mentioned in Matthew 24:29 includes not only the Jews’ falling by the edge of the sword, but also their being led into captivity, the times of the gentiles, and thus, the entire interadvental period.” It appears that Dr. Waldron believes we’re still living in the time of the Gentiles, therefore, the entirety of Luke 21 cannot yet be fulfilled. A further dive into Luke’s gospel is necessary, so let’s examine the broader context of the passage in question by going back 2 more verses.
22 for these are the days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. 23 Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. 24 They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among all the nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. Luke 21:22-24
A cursory reading of the text makes it clear that these three verses are tethered together. The “days” of vengeance in verse 22 are the same days verse 23 calls “those days”, just as “this people” who would see the distress in verse 23 are the same “they” that will fall by the edge of the sword in verse 24. That being the case, it’s obvious that their fulfillment must coincide, and consequently, “all that is written” is fulfilled at this time. This is problematic for Dr. Waldron’s view because he has already assigned the parallel text in Matthew 24:15-28 to A.D. 70. If the destruction of Jerusalem fulfilled all that was written, there cannot then be anything left to be fulfilled. His interpretation forces us to reinterpret Luke’s gospel to say instead, “these are the days of vengeance to fulfill some of what is written.”
Enter Daniel: A Prophetic Cross-Reference
Let’s dig deeper, though, and examine one specific event referenced here that Dr. Waldron puts in A.D. 70 (Luke 21:20; Matthew 24:15). Notice that Matthew’s version says this was spoken of by the prophet Daniel.
So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand) Matthew 24:15
This raises the question: where did Daniel speak of the abomination of desolation? There are a couple of references in Daniel we could entertain, but the obvious one is Daniel 12, a chapter about the time of “the end.”
And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. Daniel 12:11
The broader context of Daniel 12 fits as the source Jesus is pulling from in the Olivet Discourse. He is essentially saying in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 “when you see this” (the abomination of desolation) this is what Daniel predicted. That being the case, notice verse 7 of Daniel 12.
And I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the stream; he raised his right hand and his left toward heaven and swore by him who lives forever that it would be for a time, times, and half a time, and that when the shattering of the power of the holy people comes to an end all these things would be finished. Daniel 12:7
We need to ask the question, what are the “all these things” that would be finished in Daniel’s context? Namely the great tribulation (12:1), the resurrection (12:2), the judgment (12:3), and everything else pertaining to the time of “the end” (12:4, 12:9, 12:13). Since Jesus is pulling from Daniel 12, it appears that the “end” He has in mind is the same “end” as Daniel. Notice again Daniel’s timeline for these events leading to the end. He says in verse 11 there would be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. If these are the days leading to the end, we should find continuity in all of Daniel, which we do. One thousand two hundred and ninety days is approximately three and a half years, just as time, times, and half a time could be interpreted as year, years, and half a year. So Daniel is consistent that these events that lead to the end—these events that begin with the abomination of desolation and consummate with the shattering of the power of the holy people—would be for a three and a half year stretch. Let the reader keep in mind that Dr. Waldron has already given the abomination of desolation to A.D. 70 in saying Matthew 24:15-28 was fulfilled then.
But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months. Revelation 11:2
Is it purely a cosmic coincidence that John’s timeframe for the destruction of Jerusalem is consistent with Daniel’s timeframe for the shattering of the power of the holy people and the time of the end? If you think so, I’ve got a beachfront property in Babylon to sell you. Look once again at Luke’s discourse.
They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among all the nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. Luke 21:24
Is this Gentile trampling of Jerusalem not the same Gentile treading of Jerusalem John saw in Revelation 11? If not, why not? Notice what J. Stuart Russell writes about the three and a half years. “During the three years and a half which represent with sufficient accuracy the duration of the Jewish war, Jerusalem was actually in the hands and under the feet of a horde of ruffians…in August A.D. 70 the city and the temple were a heap of smoking ashes.”[1]
Using Scripture to Interpret Scripture
Daniel predicted that from the time of the abomination of desolation to the end, it would be a three and a half year period. John predicted that Jerusalem would be trampled by Gentiles for a three and a half year period. Luke predicted that when the abomination of desolation was set up that would start the days of vengeance to fulfill all that is written where Jerusalem would be trampled underfoot until the times of the Gentiles were fulfilled. Using Scripture to interpret Scripture, it could not be more clear that Luke 21:24 was fulfilled with the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70. Not to mention the “days of vengeance” comes from Deuteronomy 32 where God predicted his vengeance and covenantal judgment that would bring with it the end of Israel.[2] In A.D. 70 this judgment came, and the genealogical records were destroyed with the destruction of the temple, so there can never again be a legitimate priesthood. Old Covenant Israel saw her end and all that was written was in fact fulfilled. Whatever our concept of the nature of these events may be, the Bible is emphatic about when they would be accomplished, and they were accomplished!
Dr. Waldron writes on page 355 “To put the problem in other words, verse 29 seems to say that immediately following the destruction of Jerusalem the coming of Christ in glory occurs. How then can verses 15-28 refer to a destruction of Jerusalem that took place in A.D. 70 and verse 29 refer to a future coming of Christ in glory?” Yes, Dr. Waldron, how can that be? Let the reader pause and meditate. (Cue the Jeopardy theme music while we ponder that one.)
In the book, Dr. Waldron posits verse 34 and the “all these things” as referring to the destruction of Jerusalem but he never offers an exegesis of verses 29-33. He assumes they are future, but since we’ve demonstrated that “all that is written” was fulfilled during this time, I do not feel the need to offer a further explanation. It doesn’t take much digging to find mountains of scholarship dealing with phrases like sun, moon, and stars and the destruction of heaven and earth. What you’ll find upon further examination is that these terms were used in the Old Testament to describe judgment language, and never the destruction of our physical planet. What we have seen to this point is that Matthew 24 through verse 34 has an A.D. 70 context and that a futurist interpretation of these verses is about as useful as a white crayon on white paper.
To Pivot or Not to Pivot?
Examining verse 34 and 36, we come once again to Dr. Waldron’s “contrast” or “pivot” argument. He writes on page 357, “Verse 34 must be contrasted with verse 36 or the entire meaning of the passage will be mistaken.” There are a myriad of reasons why this viewpoint doesn’t work, and it has been refuted by many exegetes in the past, but notice his next quote from page 358. “Second, this interpretation of Matthew 24:34-36 fits well with Matthew 24:3. There Jesus’s disciples plainly associate the destruction of the temple and the second coming. It was necessary for this confusion to be sorted out if Jesus’s disciples were not to be left vulnerable to terrible disillusionment.” In his mind, the disciples were wrong to associate the destruction of the temple with Christ’s parousia, so he presupposes that they were wrong and in the Olivet Discourse Jesus is correcting them. That idea must be proven though, so let’s ask the question, where would the disciples ever get that idea to begin with?
In the vision of Daniel’s 70 weeks in Daniel 9 we find that the end of the city and the temple comes with a flood (26), and results in bringing in everlasting righteousness (24). But according to his promise we are waiting for a new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. 2 Peter 3:13 Heaven and earth will pass away but my words will not pass away. Matthew 24:35
In other words, the new heaven and earth which fulfills Daniel’s 70 weeks comes with the passing away of the old heaven and earth—with the destruction of the city and the sanctuary. It’s also worth noting that Daniel 9:27 is another reference to the abomination of desolation which Dr. Waldron has already placed in A.D. 70. Like their master, Christ’s Jewish disciples would’ve had the eschatology of Daniel which clearly taught the “end” to be at the time of the destruction of the temple. Perhaps Jesus also had Daniel 12 in mind where the “end” comes with the shattering of the power of the holy people. Would Dr. Waldron posit that one day the church will be completely shattered? If he does, I could not find that view in his book. That leaves the holy people to be Daniel’s people, the Old Covenant Jews (Daniel 9:24). It’s also worth noting that in the Olivet Discourse, the entire discussion (including the predictions such as the abomination of desolation) is framed around a question about the “end” of the age (Matthew 24:3). It appears that Jesus and the disciples were familiar with the Old Testament.
When we come to the New Testament, we need not look hard to find that Jesus himself prophesied about his parousia well before the Olivet Discourse. He taught many things during the time of his ministry that no doubt would’ve informed the disciples understanding of the events surrounding his second coming. Luke 17 for example is a section where Jesus is teaching his disciples about the nature of the coming of the kingdom, and in it He prophesies several of the same events seen in the Olivet Discourse. The kicker here is that He orders them quite differently than He does later in His ministry. Remember, Dr. Waldron gives much to A.D. 70 but says essentially everything from Matthew 24:35 and on is still future.
As seen on this famous chart[3], in Luke 17 Jesus puts the second coming and events of Matthew 24:37-41 before Matthew 24:17, 18, and 26-28, all of which predict events Dr. Waldron has already admitted were fulfilled by A.D. 70. With that in mind, observe this quote from Chapter 28 of Dr. Waldron’s book, speaking on Luke 17. “The correct interpretation begins by observing that verses 20 and 21 are closely connected with the speech of Jesus that follows. What is Jesus talking about in that following speech? Clearly, He is talking about His second coming. That is the time when the kingdom of God comes in the future in power and glory.” If Luke 17 is the second coming but Dr. Waldron has already placed some of those identical events seen in the Olivet Discourse as A.D. 70, that’s an enormous problem for his view! Who is really mistaken about the timing and nature of the second coming, Jesus and his disciples or Dr. Sam Waldron?
Beyond that, we’ve already examined that the “you” in the Olivet Discourse was Jesus’ first-century disciples. It was the “you” in Matthew 24:34 who was the generation that would see “all these things” take place. Dr. Waldron says that’s A.D. 70 and I agree. Now, what about the ‘you’ in Matthew 24:42, 44, 47; 25:8, 9, 12, 21, 23, 24, 25, 27, 34, 37-40, and 44? What contextual basis does he have for arbitrarily switching the audience hearing Christ’s predictions of things they would see, to being a totally disconnected group 2,000+ years in the future? Was there a secret time traveler hiding in the crowd that day? Perhaps the disciples didn’t need rescuing from associating the second coming with the destruction of the temple. Perhaps it is the modern church who needs to be rescued from distorting the plain and obvious reading of the text, which is consistent with the entirety of biblical eschatology. There is no pivot in Matthew 24:36 and this verse does not harm the view of full preterism. In fact, it only works to strengthen it.
35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away. 36 But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only. Matthew 24:35-36
That “day and hour” is a direct reference to the previous verse where heaven and earth pass away. Hebrews 1 speaks of the heavens and the earth wearing out. They will perish, but you remain. They will all wear out like a garment. Hebrews 1:11. That word for “wear out” is the Greek word palaioo and it’s used three times in the New Testament, two of which are in the book of Hebrews. The second reference is in Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. Hebrews 8:13
“Becoming obsolete” there is the same word that spoke of the heavens and earth wearing out, and in the context, the author is clearly speaking of the Old Covenant system. Milton Terry writes, “It is the solemn termination and crisis of the dispensation which had run its course when the temple fell, and there was not left one stone upon another which was not thrown down. That catastrophe, which in Heb xii, 26, is conceived as a shaking of the earth and the heaven, is the end contemplated in this discourse; not ‘the end of the world,’ but the termination and consummation of the pre-Messianic age.”[4]
In Matthew 24:36 “that day and that hour” refers back one verse to the passing away of heaven and earth, which clearly occurred in A.D. 70 with the destruction of the Old Covenant order. The Olivet Discourse is not a divided discourse. From start to finish—from Matthew 24:1 to Matthew 25:46— it concerns the events the disciples would see, within a generation, that were fulfilled with perfect, prophetic accuracy in the time leading up to and the events of the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple.
Conclusion
We’ve carefully walked through Daniel, Luke, Matthew, and Revelation—and what have we found? A consistent, prophetic roadmap leading unmistakably to A.D. 70. The abomination of desolation, the days of vengeance, the trampling of Jerusalem, the shattering of the power of the holy people—all converge in one historical moment, not scattered across millennia. The Olivet Discourse is not a divided offering of past and future events punctuated by a mysterious pivot verse. It’s a unified prophecy delivered to a specific audience about events they were told they would live to see. The plain reading of the text, the timeline given by Daniel, and the context of Jesus’ teaching harmonize into a singular message: judgment was coming upon that generation—and it did. In the next installment, we’ll see whether Dr. Waldron can make Matthew 16 tell a different story, or whether it too points to a conclusion that’s already on the books.
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[1] James Stuart Russell, The Parousia: A Study of the New Testament Doctrine of Our Lord’s Second Coming
[2] For more on Deuteronomy 32 see Mike Sullivan’s book, Moses to Messiah
[3] Original source unknown
[4] Milton Terry, Biblical Apocalyptics: A Study of the Most Notable Revelations of God and of Christ